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 EXI 500

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akent




PostSubject: EXI 500   Wed Sep 16, 2009 10:00 pm

FD, are you flying your Exi 500?

My Exi 500 is the finest flying machine that I have. I hope to get the ES600 flying as smoothly one of these days. With that heli, I can actually do some smooth rolls, loops and flips. I can't do that with my 450, as it's too darty, and I don't have the ES600 setup right, yet, but the ES600 has real promise as the cyclic is VERY responsive.

I will never buy anything but the carbon Exi 500 or the Trex 500 ESP in that class. I was lucky enough to have bought my second Exi 500 before they ran out of em at Xheli. That's my backup!

I have tried an Align torque tube and no thanks. They are far too expensive to repair and are really fragile. I like the belt just fine.

For your Exi, all you need are Align shafts and gears. The Exi shafts come prebent and the gears prewarped sometimes. Align bearings are also much higher quality.

Oh course, if you build up the ES500, I'm sure lots of folks will be very interested, and I'm all ears and eyes for that!

Here's my 500...


Oh, sorry for the off topic...

Best,
Kent
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Donnie D

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PostSubject: Re: EXI 500   Wed Sep 16, 2009 10:07 pm

What is a torque tube? I know it is a tail drive system, but how about describe it and how it works.

Donnie D smiley-happy088
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Fatdaddy

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PostSubject: EXI   Sat Sep 19, 2009 3:11 pm

Yea I fly mine everyday.. I fly that more than anything else... I really like the T.T. Mysely, but I haven't crashed it yet either.. I started out with the KDE thrusted main bearing set up and my shaft was perfect, Already changed to the Trex gears and mixing arms,upper and lower. I use the Trex yellow landing struts with black pipes..
I actually have mine tamed down for now as I'm not planning on doing any stunts wityh it just yet, but yes I also think it is one of my top birds..second I'd say cause my Outrage G5 is soooo much nicer in everyway than all the rest!!!! I really wish I'd snached up a second one my self....
And I will be building the ESKY 900 As soon as I get it.. I also will have one for sale... I'm just not sure if I will sell it as a kit or built..
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Fatdaddy

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PostSubject: Motor mount   Sun Sep 20, 2009 12:37 am

Got the finned CNC Motor Mount for the EXI today!!! It is really sweet.. Hopefully it will take care of the hot running motor on the 500..!!
Flew it (3Batt. ) today!!1 Man this thing smokes!!!! It IS ready to do what ever I ask!!!!
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Fatdaddy

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PostSubject: EXI 500   Sun Sep 20, 2009 2:41 pm

Here is my EXI 500, New motor plate and pinion change. Also trying out a set of them 3D blades.. Not too bad at all, for like 21.00 there GREAT!!!! Not as stiff and strong as the Mav. G5's I've been flyin but really nice!!!


This thing is SMOKIN fast now!!!!!
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Mozzy

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PostSubject: Re: EXI 500   Mon Sep 21, 2009 3:57 am

Fatdaddy and Kent,

I am building the HKH-500.
It will be a budget build.
For cyclic I think I will use this servo, $12.35 at HK.
And most likely this Turnigy 1800kv motor, $24.95 at HK.

Not sure yet about the ESC. Whether to use this one, which has a linear BEC (3A 5V). Or to use this ESC with an external UBEC. What is your opinion on this?
The HK ESC is supposed to be good. But I think I prefer not to go cheap on the ESC. For my HK-450, I started of with a Mystery ESC FM-30A ($15). It worked for a few flights. But then the brake function got selected and it cannot be turned off anymore, (I was able to program it before). Also this card won't work with a programming card orange83 Now I have a Hobbywing 30A, just love it!

And then the tail servo. How much torque should this servo have for a 500-class heli? What servo would you guys recommend to use?
The gyro will be a Telebee. Rx will be AR6200 Spektrum.

Thanks!!!
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Fatdaddy

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PostSubject: 500   Mon Sep 21, 2009 12:50 pm

Hey MOZ, Looks like your off to a good start to me.... I really wish Xheli still had the CF EXI500 but sometimes you just are too late, I'd really love to have a spare!!!
Anyway yours looks to be a good 500 and your doing it right.. I think the servos your gonna use are FAST!!!! I'm like shocked at their speed!!!!
They are more than fast enough to use on the tail too!!!! I use one the same size as that on my EXI(I Think) Ino-Lab 261HB @ 59 and its .07!!
So I say order 4 and use it all around!! And 12 bucks I'd order some spares!!!
For the ESC, I only use HobbyWing and I like the PLATINUM best, they cost the most but work GREAT and I've never had ANY trouble..I've got the 80A on my 500.. I do also have a HDX 5oo and have a volcaino 60A on that but run only 4S and have not flown that enough to have a opinion yet..
So, I think your on the right track, anything else do not hstatiate to ask!!! Your gonna LOVE the 500 size and how it flys!!! Its like a vette!!!!
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burton8012




PostSubject: Re: EXI 500   Mon Sep 21, 2009 3:09 pm

u can get a CF exi 500 on hobbyparts.com the same company as xheli.com but them want 299.00 what the hell is up with that
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P3tras

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PostSubject: Re: EXI 500   Mon Sep 21, 2009 3:24 pm

Hi Mozzy,
I say buy turning plush ESC (red one) and program card for it. It is very good ESC. Don't buy HK ESC. It doesn't have many functions (like soft start)
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Nuttcaze
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PostSubject: Re: EXI 500   Mon Sep 21, 2009 3:57 pm

+1 for Hobbywing ESC's

I use Hobbywing ESC's on my ES600's and just bought a Turnigy 60A for my next heli, the ES500. Turnigy ESC's are pretty much the same thing except with a different covering and label. I bought a 60A that has a BEC built in but I don't trust any ESC over 40A with a built in BEC so I added my own, I got my ESC from Hobbycity and got my BEC from Helidirect, I use the same BEC on both of my ES600's. Works great and only $18

http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=2166&Product_Name=TURNIGY_Plush_60amp_Speed_Controller

http://www.helidirect.com/maxpro-high-voltage-210s-lipo-switchable-bec-p-8149.hdx


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Mozzy

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PostSubject: Re: EXI 500   Mon Sep 21, 2009 5:32 pm

Thanks guys for the input.

Marc, nice video! I also had my doubts about the internal BEC.
So, the Turnigy it is with an external UBEC :bigthumb:

Any thoughts on the tail servo, what servo's are you using on the EXI-500 or planning to use on the ES500? Although the specs on the $12 HK servo's look okay for the tail I would prefer a digital servo. Is 2.0 kg of torque the bottom limit without using the Chinees weights?

Having second thought about the motor. I it seems to be very powerfull (throttle needs to be turned adjusted down), but draws a lot of Amps and gets hot.
Found two 1600kV motors. This one also at HK for $23, draws less current (55A max) and is reported to stay cool. Will work with 60A ESC.
Or this one at Dealextreme for $21.50, which might require a 80A ESC.

So, haven't desided yet. But now hurry, prefer to do good research first before buying.
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Fatdaddy

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PostSubject: EXI   Mon Sep 21, 2009 5:47 pm

Hey Moz, I use the HobbyWing Platinum 80A W/BEC!!!! I use the internal BEC and NEVER had even a hint of a problem!! I have a 60A valcano W/BEC on the HDX 500 both running Scorpion's 1600/EXI & 1290/HDX!!
For the tail:
I use a Ino-Lab 261HB on everything 500 and up.. It goes for 59 but as you mention, its dig. and you do need a good servo on the tail... I found a guy that I'm gettin GREAT deals on electric stuff and he got me 2 of the 261's for 40 ea.. He says they are hard for him to get..
On your motor.. adj. your pinion size if you need to slow it down with the TX AND its running hot!!!
Reducing the size will take care of both!!
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Nuttcaze
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PostSubject: Re: EXI 500   Mon Sep 21, 2009 6:02 pm

Its generally recommended to use a separate BEC or Rx battery when using higher amp ESC's, if I can find the article I'll post it, but for me its another case of "Why risk it?" If the ESC ever failed in flight the whole heli would just drop where as with a separate BEC or Rx battery you will still be able to control the heli, again just cheap insurance I hope I never need but its always there orange72

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Owneroppie




PostSubject: Started the exi 500 last night   Mon Sep 21, 2009 6:07 pm

When I put the belt on, Is there a preference it what side of the frame to take off (left or right?).

(Jumped the gun by putting the landing gear on, Im sure there will be lots of back-peddling.)

Thanks
Jeff
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Fatdaddy

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PostSubject: ESC/BEC   Mon Sep 21, 2009 8:35 pm

Really, I had not ever heard that it WAS recomended, I just thought some pilots were extra careful...
But since the new Technoligy, you never hear of any failures, least I've never heard of a BEC in a ESC failing.Not a good quility one..and its hard enough to mount the stuff you need and wires!!! For me if I can get rid of the extra item them it more than worth it.. Also, I think there is as much chance to get a bad wire connection, or sodier joint as a BEC failure..Now I use a REC. battery on my "E" and do have the Metal "E" set up with a HW OPTO and BEC but that is only because I did them before I knew any better..But really its a personal choice!!!
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Nuttcaze
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PostSubject: Re: EXI 500   Mon Sep 21, 2009 9:17 pm

well for everyone else, here is the article I was talking about, its from Helidirect, using a seperate BEC is cheap insurance, and despite the advances in technology, there are still plenty of people who have had an ESC fail causing them to lose control of their heli, you just don't normally hear about it because most people use seperate BEC's or Rx batteries for big helis.

http://www.helidirect.com/Manual/bec.pdf

Quote :
ESC’s and BEC’s

Why the battery eliminator circuit in your electronic speed control
may not be up to the task.
Many electronic speed controllers (ESC’s) have built in battery eliminator circuits (BEC’s).
The manufacturers provide this as a convenience to end users and in certain applications they do work well.

However, many BEC’s are under rated (output current wise) for the tasks we are asking.

So be careful if you are thinking of using the BEC build into your ESC. Carefully check its maximum continuous and peak current ratings, and compare this to what you expect your servos and receiver actually will draw in flight. Typically a BEC built into an ESC may only be capable of delivering 3‐4 amps. Even if it is a 120 amp ESC – which you are going to use on a 600 size electric helicopter – you may expect the BEC output will be okay, but often it wont be – this class of model with high end servos may draw 6‐8 amps or more! Of course, this same ESC used in an aircraft with ‘sport’ servos may work just fine with the low current built in BEC.

So the Solution:
In most medium or larger models the ESC’s BEC current rating is likely to be inadequate. Furthermore, for the sake of reliability, a separate BEC / regulator should normally be used in medium size or bigger models – perhaps even using its own dedicated battery.

Picking a Separate BEC
There are many options for separate BEC’s / regulators. They have different output voltages, different basic design (switch mode or linear) and different current ratings. We suggest you pay careful consideration to picking one you are sure will work with your equipment.

Some Background:
All radio control models have (by definition) a receiver, which typically requires a ‘4.8 volt nominal’ power supply (I say 4.8 volt to refer to the traditional 4 cell nicad pack – in fact most receivers are happy with a 5‐6 volt input, and some even higher – for example the Spektrum 2.4g receivers). This same supply driving the receiver (again, there are exceptions) drives the servos. Most servos are rated for ‘4.8 volts nominal’, some are compatible with 6 volts, and some even 2S lithium (7.4V nominal).

Again, without introducing undue complication, most current helicopter tail rotor (TR) servos are only rated to 4.8 volts nominal, so some sort of additional voltage reduction is needed for the TR servo if the receiver supply is greater than this (perhaps by way of diodes if the receiver is getting a regulated supply, or by a small voltage regulator if the receiver is running on an unregulated higher voltage).

On a glow (nitro) model, one would have a battery pack specifically designated to drive the receiver and servos. There are many possibilities – 4 or 5 cell nicad/NiMH, 2 cell lithium, etc with or without voltage regulation to the receiver and all servos, or just some servos (eg TR).

On an electric model, we have the option of powering the receiver and servos in the same manner as described above for a nitro model, or using the (typically larger) electric motor battery to power everything. The voltage can be regulated to the required (lower) voltage using either the BEC built into many ESC’s, or a separate regulator/BEC still using the main motor battery.
Advantages of a totally independant receiver/servo power supply in an electric model:
The receiver power supply is totally independent of that for the electric motor.
The motor battery / ESC BEC has a certain failure rate (in part due to high voltages and currents involved). If the battery / ESC BEC fails, the model typically crashes.
Disadvantages a separate receiver/servo power supply include:
Added weight
Added space usage with more components to mount.

So Typically:
With smaller models (where weight and space are at a premium), the receiver/servos would be normally be run using the main motor battery and using the BEC built into the motor ESC.

With medium sized models often you may use the main motor battery, but use a separate regulator/BEC rather than the one built into the ESC.

With larger models, most would recommend a separate battery (and separate regulator /BEC if required).

The definition of model size is rather arbitrary. But as a guide a small model may typically be a 250‐450 size helicopter. A medium model a 500 size helicopter, and a large model a 600 size helicopter or bigger.

So at Last, We Arrive at the Question:
Why the battery eliminator circuit in your electronic speed control
may not be up to the task?

Carefully check the specifications of your BEC (whether it is built into the ESC or not)

You of course need to know the expected current draw of receiver, all the servos, gyro, governor, etc in your model. Calculating this figure is difficult, and deciding on a conservative (or otherwise) total current draw to plan your installation is not simple. You need a device to measure current draw, and look at dynamic and stalled current draw of all your servos, etc.

To give you some idea, the stalled current of a Futaba 9256 TR servo is in the order of 1.5 amps. The stalled current draw of a JR 8717 is in the order of 3 amps or so. Of course, we should not stall our servos should we?

Just the on bench ‘wiggling of sticks’ moving 3 x 8717’s (unloaded – ie no flight loads) can cause current draws of 4‐6amps continuous.

So you can quickly see if you are running modern high speed high torque servos in a ‘600’ size or larger model, you need a very robust receiver / servo power supply!

And I Will Repeat Myself………

Be careful if you are thinking of using the BEC build into your ESC. Carefully check its maximum continuous and peak current ratings, and compare this to what you expect your servos and receiver actually will draw in flight. Typically a BEC built into an ESC may only be capable of delivering 3‐4 amps. So even if it is a 120 amp ESC – which you are going to use on a 600 size electric – you may think the BEC output will be okay, but as you can see it wont be! Of course, this same ESC used in an aircraft with ‘sport’ servos may work just fine with this low current built in BEC.

So the Solution:
In most medium or larger models the ESC’s BEC current rating is likely to be inadequate. Furthermore, for the sake of reliability, a separate BEC / regulator should normally be used in medium size or bigger models – perhaps even using its own dedicated battery.

Picking a Separate BEC
There are many options for separate BEC’s / regulators. They have different output voltages, different basic design (switch mode or linear) and different current ratings. We suggest you pay careful consideration to picking one you are sure will work with your equipment.

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Fatdaddy

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PostSubject: ESC/BEC/UBEC!!   Mon Sep 21, 2009 10:18 pm

Hey sorry bud, I was only giving MY own thought's.. I'm sorry if it came across diff.... I've never seen this and I'm really glad you posted it so I could read it... We need this kinda stuff as permanent
pots!! Maybe a sticky for warnings??? This article really makes good sense and now its something I think I will view differently.. Thanks for it!!
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Nuttcaze
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PostSubject: Re: EXI 500   Tue Sep 22, 2009 12:06 am

nah, I wasn't trying to give you any grief about how you set up your helis, just wanted the others to know about BEC's a little better, I wasn't trying to change your mind but sounds like I might have piqued your interest so that was a good thing. :giggle:

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cgetman02

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PostSubject: Starting to feel the beginings of helicopteritis for an EXI 500 CF   Tue Sep 22, 2009 9:20 pm

I seem to be watching the Xheli site pretty closely for the EXI 500 CF to come back into stock. At $140 I'll probably have to take the plunge and purchase the remaining parts a little at a time. I ran across this forum thread and thought I would share it with the group.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=991948

I really should just concentrate on learning to fly my 450's better. But, that darn EXI 500 CF sure looks good!

Crazysmile
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Fatdaddy

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PostSubject: EXI 5   Tue Sep 22, 2009 10:12 pm

Welll it is soooo much easier to fly than a 450 you would not believe it.. You are gonna have to beat me to buying it when they get them back!!!!! I'm soooo tempted to pick up one of the plastic just cause the CF is so nice...I really love mine!!!! I don't know if they all fly like mine or I just hit it major perfect in building, but it is BADDDDDDD ASSSSSS!!!!
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cgetman02

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PostSubject: Let me know if you see them in stock   Tue Sep 22, 2009 10:32 pm

FD,

If you run across them in stock please let me know. I have been scouring the net looking for a site I swear I saw that was the offshore supplier of the EXI 500 CF kits. Of course I didn't bookmark it or anything.

Thanks, Curt
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Fatdaddy

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PostSubject: EXI5   Tue Sep 22, 2009 10:58 pm

You can get it at HobbyPartz.com!!!! But its going for like 299 I think!!!! That makes gettin a ESKY 900 a good deal...Deals for them may be gettin better than first thought..!!
I think a plastic is worth gettin if you don't have a 500 yet.. I think the head is all metal like the CF model and what I did was go with the TREX Toqure nTube... and that comes with a metal tail box!!
That kit is 80. and is a direct swap..And is, In my opinion, a sweet upgrade!!!
Otherwise go to the co. that makes them...I have it somewhere, maybe I'll look around...I paid 199 for mine anyway..
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cgetman02

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PostSubject: Skya looks like the mfg.   Wed Sep 23, 2009 5:35 am

FD,

Skya looks to be the mfg. The best $ I have found is $177 so far. Xheli still is looking pretty good, if they ever get them back in stock.
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Mozzy

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PostSubject: Re: EXI 500   Wed Sep 23, 2009 7:10 am

That is a great deal $ 140 for the EXI500 CF :clap:
Would love to buy one (and sell my HKH-500). But I think the shipping costs will kill me. Can't check for the CF version since it is out of stock. But for the plastic version, shipping will set me back $ 72. That doubles the value of the heli Crazysmile
Plus I don't now whether Xheli is willing to declare a lower value, otherwise I have to pay taxes as well. AAAAARGH redface
To ugrade by HKH-500 to full metal head and tail costs about the same as the EXI500 CF. A this is killing me....
The EXI 500 CF is a beauty orange58
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Owneroppie




PostSubject: exi500 plastic version   Wed Sep 23, 2009 8:03 am

cget,

I think you cant go wrong with the $77.00 version at Xheli right now. It has a full metal head. I just received it in the mail a week or so ago and the quality looks really decent. When I compare the exi500 to my belt cpv2, it makes me want to order the $49 version exi450 (metal head) and swap everything over and eventually upgrade the esky parts off. (not a fan of plastic heads at all).

Who knows how long it will take and if they ever re-stock the exi500. Even if they re-stock it, you may not see that price again.

Jeff
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Owneroppie




PostSubject: EXI500 carbon version v. plastic version   Wed Sep 23, 2009 8:43 am

Just found an older post that compares the two versions. Just passing this info on.plastic version actually has a lot of metal in it.

the difference between metal & plastic
1. CF frame instead of aluminum
2. metal tail box instead of aluminum
3. CF and metal servo holder instead of simple plastic
4. metal tail blade grips instead of plastic
5. metal front boom holder instead of plastic
6. CF fins instead of plastic
7. light weight paddles ?

You can find the carbon/metal parts as needed when time to replace or upgrade. Hope this helps.

Jeff
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Fatdaddy

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PostSubject: EXI   Wed Sep 23, 2009 12:41 pm

Hey All, My advice about this whole EXI debate,,,,, BUY the plastic!!!! Mainly because if /when the CF get back in stock I really don't believe that you are gonna see the sale price again soon... I bought mine when I saw the first sale price of 199.00 and I would buy it again in a SECOND for the 199.00
But anyway, buy the plastic just so you will have one.. Then simply get the upgrades as you need/want/can afford/ them// You can get any/all the upgrades at T-Rex-Parts.com.... If you don't get one you will be missing the best (IMO) 500 class heli...
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Nuttcaze
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PostSubject: Re: EXI 500   Wed Sep 23, 2009 3:21 pm

+1 for getting the Plastic EXI500

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sdjb

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PostSubject: Re: EXI 500   Wed Sep 23, 2009 9:46 pm

Ordered one today the Plastic Version, Hey Nuttzy what ya think of this motor for the EXI500?
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.20083

sdjb
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Nuttcaze
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PostSubject: Re: EXI 500   Wed Sep 23, 2009 9:59 pm

not sure, I don't have much experience in picking motors orange78 but for the price I might try it, then again your heli could die in mid flight because of the cheapy motor

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